Tim

I have ABS 3D printed parts as small as 72 scale that are over 10 years old and have not deteriorated at all. Others in our Association have parts that are much older and still no signs of and breakdown. Granted they are painted but I do have parts in my spares boxes, some 15 years old and no sign of deterioration and they have not been painted.

I very much enjoy 3D modelling it is one the most attractive aspects of the hobby. Although these days I use a combination of 3D Printing, CNC and Styrene stock to make most parts. Determining just how the part will be manufactured is very enjoyable. I will admit I do not always get this right first time around but you learn from every mistake.

Hi Tim, you've nailed one of the critical aspects of 3D printing: durability over time.
I honestly don't know how long they last.
Also, as you said, for those who can no longer model by hand, a 3D printer is an excellent fallback.
While I recognize the great utility of 3D printing, I don't rely on it to build particularly valuable pieces (for which I prefer other materials) or very small pieces subject to many types of stress (tensile and torsional stress, for example).
It's obvious that the hull of a barge can be made of plastic, and therefore also with a 3D printer, without losing much aesthetic quality, but a wooden hull absolutely cannot (especially if it's an ancient ship).
As I mentioned, I compared the resistance of very thin pieces, and in that case, the 3D printer didn't satisfy me. I preferred other materials to other construction techniques (see the images).

I mentioned cannons and cannon carriages. Well, I needed the cannon to be very light and not subject to any stress, so the 3D printer solution was optimal.
The carriage, on the other hand, was made of wood and brass.
Look at images. It's clear that I couldn't have made such small pieces with a 3D printer and expected them to resist traction and torsion. Moreover, these small objects are still subject to some stress.
I had to resort to tinning the copper to ensure it wouldn't bend every time the blocks were pulled.

Remaining in the realm of very fine objects, I've already mentioned the lateral cranes. Essentially, they are tapered tubes (ranging from a diameter of about 3 mm to about 1 mm) and curved.
I needed flexibility, lightness, and resistance to impacts and involuntary maneuvers, so I found an alternative solution that, in my opinion, is much better than 3D printing (if you're interested in the details, you can read message no. 514 in the link at the end).
In this regard, it's clear that for such small pieces, hollow parts don't exist. The ability to fill hollow parts with a more or less dense reinforcing mesh only exists for parts of a certain size, certainly not 1 or 2 mm.
Furthermore, creating hollow parts where you can specify the amount of infill is definitely not a "trick of the trade" but rather a fundamental skill in 3D printing—it's the ABCs. When I read that a basic function is called a trick of the trade, I understand a lot (or rather, I find confirmation).


https://model-boats.com/forum/128542

ABS is a very common material and has been around for quite a long time. 3D printer filament in ABS is a quite common use in recent years.

You might have seen (and still see) ABS on cars, for instance door handles and other trim. Usually black in color. Some might have faded to some shade of gray. One might of heard of these breaking due to a combination of UV exposure and fatigue.

I'm sure that any breakdown of ABS can be controlled by a protective finish and for models I always paint my ABS prints. For real cars they have a spray coating that brings back the dark black finish that seems to absorb into the ABS. Makes it look new and feel again.

Bottom line is to protect the ABS with an opaque paint even if you are using black ABS and want a black finish. You will probably be happy with the results.

There are many "tricks of the trade" for 3D printing that many experienced users know about and doubters don't. This includes making hollow parts where you can specify the amount of infill. Take for instance a basic shape like a cube. You can make one with all six sides having a solid surface and the inside varying from empty up to completely full automatically. One can make virtually the vast majority of various shaped objects this way. (See photo with tops cut off.) This is only one example of the advantages of 3D printing.

Lew

Hello Alessandro and others who are interested,
Due to manual problems I have to use 3d printers to get the details that I want. I would much rather use more traditional and proven materials. I am incredibly pleased with the results that I can get using simple programs like online Tinkercad. However what worries me is how long do 3d printed parts last before they decompose? Will my models rot away before I do?
Currently I am trying to find a resin that is hard but not brittle also more environmentally friendly. Any suggestions let me know.
Best wishes to all Tim.

I have made "kits" of parts in the past, like the LL sweep winch pictured down the thread somewhere, but I prefer to use a combination of all disciplines. Who remembers the "gummed paper tape" construction method?

You're absolutely right, Nick.

Ultimately, it's the result that counts, and I'm very happy you like it.
Thanks for the compliments.

In this case, I preferred the piece made with this method rather than the 3D printer for several reasons, primarily aesthetics.
In fact, I liked this result much more than the one achieved with the 3D printer.

For the cannons, things were different. In that case, the 3D printer was the only solution, or at least the best.
I needed a customized design and lightweight products.
In that case, I was very pleased with the 3D printer result.
However, I'm only referring to the cannon, because the carriage is made of wood and brass (in addition to the rigging, of course).

Nice funnel! Good to use different techniques and materials. At the end of the day, it matters not how a quality piece like that is produced, it is the end result that counts.

Hi Tim, in message no. 52 of this topic, I also wrote this:

"I had a bad experience with the funmel. I had designed it and had it printed. I left it in a wooden tool shed for a few months before assembling it. When I was ready to attach it, I noticed it had warped. Unfortunately, I don't remember if it was made of ABS or PLA.
I discarded it and made the new funmel out of three materials (aluminum, plastic, and wood). I don't have a PC with me, but as soon as I can, I'll attach photos so you can see the notable difference."

Sorry but I forgot to attach the photos.
As they say: better late than never.

As you can see I used the different materials I mentioned.

From the sequence of images, the method I used should be pretty clear, but if you have any questions, please ask.

Thanks Lew that is clearer now. I use a combination of 3D printing, CNC for parts that are flat and styrene rods and bars both rectangular and round. Also I have used brass and regularly use cerated nuts which can be mounted into the 3D print using heat or softening with glue. This allows parts to be unscrewed. Whilst I still use 3D printing exclusively for my parts and swear by it I augment the manufacturing process as described above.

Bob

What I was getting at is if someone makes a claim that rather than use a 3D print there is a stock material that is better and more resilient.
Lew

Well, as some of you guys know, this Bluebird K7 is 100% a 3D print. It is strong as iron and almost weighs as much despite being hollow. The voids are filled with an intricate lattice of ultra thin plastic that is almost impossible to cut as I have adapted it to house a brushless/lipo Traxxas Spartan prop drive system.

I am not sure exactly what type of plastic the gentleman used to print this beast, in addition to being super strong and difficult to cut, it is almost impossible to sand. It’s been a battle.

As for Lew’s question on additional materials, over the years I have made molds and made parts from poured two-part epoxies and used PETG plastic to vacuum-form parts including the canopy of this K7. I am also a huge basswood fan and enjoy using mahogany veneers as well. Not to mention foam sheet for airplane wings.and lest we forget…fiber glass!
👍🏻😉

Lew not entirely sure what you are driving at but some time ago I tried some of the more exotic filaments including polycardonates. I even invested in a device that would smooth them using an alcohol bath. Whilst the parts themselves turned out very well the issue was sticking them to the model. I found the flexible superglue was best but the failure rate was just too high. The smooth surface was just too smooth I guess. Since then I have stuck exclusively with ABS + as I can reliably attach the fittings to the model.

I also use brass to make various fittings or parts of fittings. I also use styrene rods and pipes to augment some of the 3D printed parts.

Hope this is of some value.

Has anyone out there made parts for model boats out of a durable, resilient, or a combination of both beyond the various materials used in standard home printers (resin, FDM, etc)?

I'm not talking about specialty materials such as metals or glass. The type of material to compared a 3D printed part would be along the line of wood, plastic, etc. that would most likely be from stock that would need to be made from raw stock such as round, flat or sheet, or even from a cast molded liquid or gel.

Lew

😎Nick, my 3D printers are enclosed from the manufacturer. The 3D prints in ABS are strong. Not long ago I got some white ABS (I usually use black) as a friend wanted white railings. Saved him a lot of time as there were a lot of railings.
Lew

Lew. You need an enclosure for ABS. Also turn off the part cooling fan, layers stay sticky for longer. My first enclosure was literally a cardboard box set over my printer. I eventually built one from an Iker Lac coffee table. I had great success once I got the measure of it.

The choice of materials for 3D printing has been expanding quite a bit. It was recently been posted "...if I had 3D-printed the part, but it certainly wouldn't have been as resilient." This statement indicates to me that they know absolutely nothing about 3D printing.

I put this reply appropriately under this topic rather than as a reply to the build. Don't knock 3D printing if you haven't tried it. I understand that there are people that would find 3D printing difficult but don't make a false statement about something which could deter others from considering 3D printing as another tool for model building.

Lew

Hello Lew.
You are quite correct about the heat and ABS. I don't have an enclosure so my models are subject to cold draughts and temperature fluctuations. Any large models I have made warp and often come apart along the layer lines. I would prefer to print in ABS or try one of the other filaments, it's just that in my situation PLA+ seems more forgiving.
Like you I would prefer to use wood or metal but I am not skilled enough to made small things out of metal. When I was in my twenties I got my hands crushed in a glue spreading machine and lost part of my left hand and also feeling. I have had skin grafts, muscle grafts, nerve grafts and bone grafts. the only thing I haven't had is a total body transplant. A circular saw took away part of a finger on my left hand and to make matters worse about 10 years ago a cat bit me on the first finger on my right hand causing sepsis and the loss of part of that finger. The surgeons at the hospital wanted to amputate part of my hand to stop the infection. I refused to let them .Anything that I am able to make I consider a bonus. With regard to spot welding with the pen, my prefered method is to melt a hole in the plastic and immediately squirt molten plastic into the hole. Anyway To all who are reading this, Good luck and keep up the good work.
best wishes Tim

Hello AlessandroSPQR,
The model sub came from Thingiverse, the man who did the original work also produced a U-boat as well. I enlarged the model and added a bit of detail. The internal watertight container is also on Thingiverse. On Cgtrader someone called Flared phoenix has much more detailed stl. files for sale. With regard to the canon on Sir Kay, the german AA gun and the oerlikon were commercial files bought for a few pounds. Anyone interested in 3D printing and model boats, should visit Thingiverse, Cults, Cgtrader and perhaps Printables. Thingiverse files are all free, some are excellent others are not.
Best wishes to all
Tim

Hi Tim, first of all, congratulations on creating a model entirely with a 3D printer.

You've brilliantly solved the size issue (size of the model relative to the maximum size of the largest piece the 3D printer can produce). It may seem easy and obvious, but it's not.
Is the design your own, or did you obtain it from a third party, like the cannons you showed us?

Thanks for the information on PLA and ABS; I agree with what I learned before working with 3D printers.
I asked for a lot of details about the capabilities and durability of these materials. I agree with you about ABS, I wouldn't recommend it.
However, I'm not a fan of PLA either. Neither material convinces me.

I've printed and had printed many pieces in both ABS and PLA, but in the end, I've decided never to use 3D printer products for important and critical parts, subject to mechanical stress or stress, subjected to heat, or requiring long-term durability.

I had a bad experience with the funmel. I had designed it and had it printed. I left it in a wooden tool shed for a few months before assembling it. When I was ready to attach it, I noticed it had warped. Unfortunately, I don't remember if it was made of ABS or PLA.
I discarded it and made the new funmel out of three materials (aluminum, plastic, and wood). I don't have a PC with me, but as soon as I can, I'll attach photos so you can see the notable difference.

The cannons I designed and had printed by a friend of mine (after many attempts and tests with other 3D printers) could have been made out of brass. I should have used a milling cutter (which I don't have). Brass would certainly have looked better, but I would have had excessive weight above the waterline, which would be absolutely unacceptable for the lateral stability of the model.
So I have to point out a point in favor of the 3D printer in this case.

...also, can't say that I just have a thing for 3D printing. Right now I'm in the woodworking mode.

Lew

Nick, some thoughts on the use of 3D pen for welding ABS

Keep in mind that when the filament is streaming out of the nozzle, the bed and eventually the print is constantly heated to a high temperature so the filament will fuse to print.

The pen's heat is usually sufficient enough to heat the filament enough for it to extrude and stick to freshly placed thin filament but probably not to a cooled part that has some mass to it.

A better way, although I haven't tried it, might be to use a soldering iron with a long point and use some unextruded filament as a welding rod. Let me know if anyone has tried this.

Lew

Hello Tim, good conversation. I don't have much of a concern about ABS. All of my models never see any extended time outdoors. Even my most frequently used ones will get only an hour or two in our "Florida sunshine" every two weeks. Even at meets when out of the water at meets they are in the shade. Otherwise they are in my AC home. Seldom have heat on.

My Wiesel schnellboot is over 50 years old and still seems strong. Almost all of my ABS parts are painted. I did make a compartment for my auto about 6 years ago. It sees a good amount of sun and is holding up well (unpainted). Perhaps it is the thickness. Very thin ABS might be the issue.

My ABS props are holding up pretty good after frequent runs in the pond. So I guess that my successful field testing of ABS means I will be using it until something better comes along.

One more item, ABS can warp because of the type of printer used. A large, unenclosed printer can cause this because of the uneven application of heat. I use a smaller, enclosed printer.

Lew

Hi Tim.
Looks good. I was looking at a 3D printed sub at a model boat show. It was being sold by a small company for about £90 (?) and to be honest it wasn't any better than yours or as long. I have never tried ABS because as I understand it, you need a well ventilated room due to the noxious fumes etc.. After trying many filaments, I have fallen in love with ELEGOO Rapid PLA+. Like you I am in my 70's (73) and love trying new things. Anything to do with engineering keeps me happy 😁

Hello SimpleSailor,

I thought you might be interested in something that that I am experimenting with. It is a T class sub from WWII. It has been printed in PLA+ and is about 7ft long (2 metres). I made it in 6inch sections (15 cms) and stuck them together by spot welding them with a very cheap 3D pen. So far it is hanging around in the garage and been dropped from height, kicked and generally abused, so for it has not been damaged. I printed it quickly with quite thick layer settings which is why the layers are so obvious. I am going to plate it with something to represent the welded plates. Maybe even coat it with resin or paint and sand it down. The watertight container is a length of drain pipe with 3D printed and laser cut sections and end caps, rather like the Robbe sub.
Lew, just a thought but ABS breaks down under sunlight, is hygroscopic and to some extent is biodegradable. I have ABS hulls that I have bought years ago and they are now so brittle, they crack when touched. All plastics and resins have a limited lifespan. There is no perfect plastic you just find the one that suits you. I built this sub originally with ABS but after about 4 sections the sub was so horribly distorted and cracked because of cold weather and draughts which caused uneven shrinkage. Maybe the climate where you are suits ABS better. I work in a very cold garage and PLA+ just suits my environment better.Like Nick the Steam I am in my seventies, I don't expect my models to last longer than me. I build them for pleasure. Anyway good luck to you.
Fellow ship builders please don't judge the quality of the sub as it is a quick experiment. I have enjoyed reading all the comments made about 3D printing, its pros and cons.
Best wishes Tim

Hi Nick. I have a cheap pen on order. Going to give it a try. It's not for all joints, just where a fillet weld could go. Will post the outcome when the pen eventually arrives from China.. 😁

Simple Sailor, I have not tried using a 3D pen but here are the pitfalls as I see them. First, there is a chance dimensions could be altered, you wouldn't be able squish the filament down to zero thickness, using a solvent avoids this. By the time you have laid down a layer from the pen as "glue" it would have hardened enough to prevent it sticking to the part you are trying to glue too. It could possibly work by using proper welding techniques, ie allow for a fillet welding then build up with the pen and hope it sticks properly. As stated before, I have not tried using a 3D pen the above missal is just my thoughts on the subject....

Hi Olly999, you've spoken very wisely, and I agree with almost everything you've said.

However, there's a big difference between static modeling and dynamic RC modeling.
The gulf between these two hobbies is much deeper than it might seem at first glance.
In some respects, there's a chasm.
What you say, and which I almost entirely agree with, applies to dynamic RC modeling and static plastic modeling.
For classic wooden static model ships (classic, arsenal, or admiralty), a 3D printer is practically useless.
It's therefore best to distinguish between the two fields of work.
If I want to make a ship entirely out of plastic (for example, Italeri kits), I could do it with just a 3D printer.
Of course, I'd have to be really good at it.
If, on the other hand, I want to make a dynamic RC naval model (perhaps a mix of wood and plastic), a printer is certainly useful but not essential.
It's one of the many tools available to the naval modeler.
In some cases, I thought I couldn't solve the problem without a 3D printer, but instead there was always an alternative solution (which I applied), sometimes better than the 3D part I discarded.
A side note: many dynamic RC model kits come with a pre-built hull made of plastic or resin. For many modelers, this is an advantage because they aren't capable of building one with traditional keel frames and battens. In this case, knowing how to use a 3D printer to make a hull would be crucial.
Of course, the issue of size and the ability to design a hull remains.

My opinion on the use of a 3D printer remains undoubtedly positive; I consider it an additional tool for the modeler and a knowledge and skill that is also useful in other fields (as I have personally verified).

Hi All. On the subject of 3D printing and joining parts. Has anyone used a 3D Pen like a welder for doing joints etc.. I was going to buy a 3D Pen to try but thought I would ask first.

Illy999, "You hit the nail right on the head" with your post.
Lew

On a personal note, I use the mixed modelling approach. I find it difficult to see how the modeller with an average workshop space and budget could make the complete variety of parts needed for a complex and detailed model without 3D printer involvement.

I still applaud the modeller using bottle tops, wooden coffee stirrers, and things found on the beach to come up with fantastic models. One thing I think is important though is that youngsters, who are taught the skills for CAD and 3D printing in schools now, get to use those skills in a way we can appreciate. If we want our hobby to continue, then we need to embrace the new techniques and materials that allow it to progress, especially for those younger modellers, and hope that they too see the advantages of "mixed modelling" before creating the masterpieces of traditional building, themselves. After all, most modellers now will include simple plastic parts bought at the shop, whereas our grandfathers would only ever know how to make a boat from old cupboard panels, etc.

Just my thoughts, but you continue with your own build excellence, however you do it. 😉👍

Tim, my experience with using acetone on ABS printer parts is not that great. Sure, it is a solvent for ABS but I believe that because acetone evaporates very fast it doesn't penetrate the ABS surface very well thus making the contact areas very weak. My recommendation is to use a hobby cement for styrene. You can choose thin (watery) or thick (like paste). Brands like Tamiya or Testors work well.

As for PLA, I don't use it much. It is weak, biodegradable, and has no "weld" type cement. Superglue is about the only option. Haven't tried Dichloromethane, doesn't sound like I will.

Lew

Hi All

Just thought I would add some more to the conversation. As I said before I have hundreds of hours invested into Fusion 360 the CAD program I use. Also I only use one filament ABS + and I know the settings to use depending on the size and intricacy of the model. When I go to print I just want the part to print as reliably as possible. For some people 3D printing seems to be a hobby in itself and they get a kick out experimenting with new filaments and good for them. On the other hand I am looking for the most efficient and reliable way to produce the part and it works for me.

Also as I work mainly in HIPS to make decks and superstructures etc. To attach 3D parts I can use a glue made from MEK and styrene which works very well. So whilst I can make almost anything from ships boats to armaments reliably down to 72 scale I stick to just a single way of production.

This thread has been very valuable in understanding how others use the technology and who knows perhaps I will get more adventurous in future. It does show that there are always other alternatives and perhaps we should experiment and move out of our comfort zone.

Again thanks to all those who have contributed.

Dichloromethane has a similar effect on PLA as acetone does on ABS but it's nasty stuff and great care needs to be taken. Dichloromethane is also the best thing to glue PLA that I have found.

"Resin printers don't need post processing"? I disagree there.

As for ABS dissolving in Acetone, when I try the ABS jut becomes a gooey lump that hardens quickly. I haven't tried extensive stiring- if you have been able to make it into a syrup like consistency, let me know.

I am on my third filament printer and generally use some sandpaper for post processing models. For almost all my printing I use ABS. I started to build a vapor misting box (for "polishing" the prints, if needed) but will need to change my design.

Lew

Hello Alessandro,
I don't print my things with the thinness layer settings. If I did you wouldn't see any layers.
Using filament printers, modellers would print with ABS filament which dissolves in acetone. Once the object was made, it would be placed in a sealed container on a small plinth. Acetone was allowed rto swirl around the bottom of the container and the fumes would slowly dissolve the surface of the model making it smooth. ABS can be a bit temperamental in that draughts can cause deformities and cracks due to uneven cooling. The ABS also needs to be used at a higher temperature. I use PLA which is easier to use but harder to get rid of the ridges.
Resin printed models don't need post processing. The SLA printers that you saw were probably the laser ones if it was several years ago. They used to be too expensive for the average modeller. Nearly 20 years ago when I was at university doing art, the art department bought a 3D printer which used lasers to carve items from a block of material ( I think it was starch and not much of a printer, more of a carver). We never got to use it because apart from the sample models there was no way to generate a 3D model on the available computers.
I hope that answers your question
Best wishes Tim

Hi Alessandro, and other interested members. The pictures show my quick run off for the powered barge bridge. You can clearly see when zoomed in that there are layer lines and vertical aberrations. However I was testing the part to see if I could print without any supports for things like the window frames and over hangs and in one go. So no gluing.

It came out very well and only took about 45 minutes to print. The lines will always be there but can be reduced by further fine tuning. I maybe need to go through the printer resonance check again. It uses an accelerometer to test the resonant frequencies of the printer frame and then compensates. That should clear up the vertical problems. The lines are very fine and once two or three coats of paint are applied and sanded between coats, then can hardly be seen, if at all.

Once I find a good setting in my slicer (Cura) I save it as a profile then I can come straight back to it if I need to. The bridge is designed with 0.8mm thick walls and roof. I have found that when designing things in CAD it is good to have a knowledge of the printers capabilities rather than just go and design a wall to be 1mm thick I would make it multiples of 0.4mm. Then I know when I print, the slicer will use that many walls or layers. The printer has a 0.4mm nozzle. I sometimes set the wall thickness for 0.38mm. The software driving the printer is called Klipper and I must say it made a massive difference to the quality of print. A lot of printers now use Klipper as the core software.

Most of the 3D printers are FDM printers (Fused Deposition Modelling) I do not want to get into SLA (Stereolithography) as they are very messy but great for very fine detail.

Here is a good manufactures description of the different types of 3D printing.
https://www.protolabs.com/en-gb/resources/blog/types-of-3d-printing/

Hi Tim, first of all, thanks for your reply.

Let me try to explain.
When I first saw how the 3D printers I used worked, I noticed they produced various layers of material, one on top of the other.
These layers, as you also said, are responsible for the surface graining.
We tried to reduce them as much as possible by adjusting the various settings.
The idea was, if they're so small they can't be seen, it's as if they weren't there, and the result is achieved.
It was impossible to remove them.
Someone recommended various products and methods to remove them in post-production.
I simply sanded the gun carriages thoroughly before painting them.
For a long time, I thought that was the case, until one day I saw some smooth objects with absolutely no graining.
I asked this modeler how he did it, and he told me he used a stereolithography 3D printer.
I'm frantically searching for that contact and those photos to show you (so you can understand better), but without a PC, only my cell phone, I'm having a hard time.
In the meantime, while I wait for your answers, I've had a look online.
I don't understand much yet, but perhaps there's an additional process after the various layers of plastic are deposited that smooths the surfaces, eliminating the knurls.

Hello Ed,
I bought the stl. files for the Oerlikon and the German AA gun from I think Cgtrader or perhaps Cults. The deck gun from Sir Kay and the Victorian Hotchkiss I designed from plans I found on the internet. Other sites worth looking at are Thingiverse and Printables (free mostly ) amongst others. There are some beautiful Victorian naval guns on Thingiverse by Jerry Todd (site name Uhlan) who is , I believe a member of this group.
Best wishes Tim

Hello Alessandro,
I think there will always be some sort of knurling or striations as 3D printers work by printing one layer at a time. However if the layer is very thin then the striations begin to disappear. I suppose a simple analogy would be if you were making a pyramid by stacking sheets of 9mm plywood on top of each other, the layers are obvious, whereas if it was made by stacking sheets of printer paper the steps are less obvious. The original SLA printers worked by firing a laser into a vat of resin.For many years, the two main types of resin 3D printers were broadly defined as stereolithography (SLA) and digital light processing (DLP). More recently, subsets of those technologies have been introduced and further delineated, including liquid crystal display (LCD) and masked stereolithography (MSLA) 3D printing. Mine works by shining a UV light through a mask, which is an image on an LCD screen. If I was printing a pyramid say 30 cm high. The lines on the slope might be visible and the surface, perhaps feel very slightly matte. My resin printer is an Elegoo Saturn and the layers are invisible to my eyes. Once a layer of primer is applied the layers can't be seen. So to sum up it all depends on how thin you can print the layers.
Hope this helps,
Best wishes Tim

Tim
Where did you get your STLs or did you design them yourself

Reading the last two comments about 3D printers, something came to mind, and I'd like to ask the more experienced.

As I said, I belong to the second category. I have to have my 3D designs printed by third parties; I don't own a 3D printer, although I learned to use one in the past and was able to do it myself (but it wasn't my property).

I realized that many pieces lacked good definition (even when adjusting various settings).
I especially didn't like the knurling (slightly raised parallel lines on the surface).
I asked how I could achieve a completely smooth surface.
At the time, they told me it wasn't possible with that type of printer.
I then looked for some information and was told that these problems could be solved with a "stereolithography" 3D printer. With this type of printer, I could obtain objects with perfectly smooth surfaces.

SimpleSailor mentioned an SLA 3D printer, and it reminded me of something.
Consider that I haven't asked for 3D parts to be made in a few years now.

SimpleSailor, Nick, Tim, Bobby, ScouterChil, Edw and other modeling friends who know how to use a 3D printer and are familiar with the world of 3D printers, could you tell me if this is true?
Can you give me a few more details based on your knowledge and experience?

Here's the LL sweep gear off my 105ft MMS in 1/48 scale. The striped wire signifies the positive side of the sweep. Made on a Prusa Mk2S at 0.1mm layer height. All I had to go on was the diameter of the drum but a quick search of the IWM produced 3 or 4 photos so it was relatively easy to draw up in Designspark scaling from the size of the drum. It turned out ok, I'm happy with it...

Well I missed out on this one considering I have just done a build on my 3D printed hybrid barge hull I do like ScouterChil's comment from two days ago "correct sizes -things such as tires, bollocks, life rings and such." It would be interesting to see what 3D printed bollocks look like 😂. As for me I love CAD and 3D printing. I use a Creality Ender-5 S1 and FreeCad for modelling & Cura slicer. I will be getting a laser cutter in the future but when all said and done they are only tools. When I was working in R&D some years ago we had to design protypes using a drawing board and old fashioned modelling techniques. When CAD came along to our company my prayers were answered. From design to product was way faster. I retired just as 3D SLA was taking off and the first thing I did was by a 3D printer kit. It ended up looking like something from the Munster's house by the time I had finished making mods to it but I learned a lot about 3D printing. I have my Ender producing very smooth prints. However my brother has just bought a Bamboo labs printer and I would never believe anyone could produce an out of the box 3D printer that worked out of the box. But it did and with no knowledge whatsoever he is printing some amazing stuff and in different colours (Colors for US friends) Just to finish up. I get as much fun making things out of wood and plastic card.

Those are awesome Tim!!! This 3D printed forward "Ape Winch," was a huge asset my Caltex Lumba Lumba.
😉

Hello Everyone,
I thought I'd show you some of the ships guns that I've printed.
Picture 1 this is a commercial file downloaded from the internet for a few ponds. These are Oerlikons in 1/24 and 1/48th scale. this shows that once you have the file you can enlarge or shrink and also print as many copies as you want. Unless there any restrictions imposed.
Picture 2 this is a gun from a victorian gun boat in 1/48th scale. I designed this myself using a CAD program for beginners. (Tinkercad).
Picture 3 I have a Robbe U-boat and broke the gun from the wintergarten (roughly 1/40th scale). I found a commercial item but when shrunk to scale was too thin and flimsy so I modified some parts and put in supports to make it stronger. Again in Tinkercad.
Picture 4 I am in the slow process of making Sir Kay in 1/48th scale. Most of the deck fittings are made from white metal and many modellers have said that the boat can be top heavy so i designed and printed this resin gun myself, again using Tinkercad.
Some of you may notice that some of the gun barrels have a slight bend. This is because the resin cures in UV light and I used sunlight in the beginning so the tops cured faster that the underside. The cheap UV lights used in nail bars are good enough. Problem solved.
I would like to add a caveat, Filament printers won't produce this detail at this scale also the resin is evil to use. I had covid rather severely and have very little sense of smell or taste. I ignored all safety advice and started p[rinting in an enclosed space. After a short while I developed an allergic reaction to the resin and ended up with allergic dermatitis. I found it difficult to open my eyes and see, also my arms and face were covered in flaking skin and scabs. My wife said I looked like a Crocodile Man (not a super hero). So follow safety precautions.
Sorry if this is a long posting,
Best wishes Tim

Hey Tim, I have built several FDM type 3D printers, I started with a Tronxy xxxx (I can't remember the model) and was bitten by the bug. I have built two modified Prusas and an Anycubic Kossell type. You are quite correct, 3D printers are, to some extent self replicating machines. I have used RAMPS/Arduino and RUMBA boards, all good stuff. The satisfaction when your first 3d printer build bursts in to life is immeasurable! Once I had the basics I started slapping NEMA stepper motors on my lathe and mill for a bit of basic automation, but I must confess using the lathe with a basic cnc program was beyond me. I have built a 20W laser cutter and a couple of cnc router, they all work the same way, just different tool heads are utilised for each machine. It's all good fun, I am 70 and only started playing with all this kit about 7 years ago having no prior experience. So, to those who may be thinking of taking the plunge I say have a go it ain't rocket science and quite easy to master once you know the principles.

Hello everyone,
I made my 3D printer from a kit and over years have 3d printed new, better parts and also made upgrades. It might seem bizarre, but with a 3D printer you can print much of a new printer. For the electronics all you need to control the printer is an arduino and a RAMPS board which is mainly a stepper motor controller. At the moment I am printing an attachment to turn the printer into a laser cutter by replacing the print head with a laser. It is possible to use the laser from a DVD drive but that is not powerful enough to cut only burn. It also possible to replace the print head with something like a Dremel and router bit to turn it into a CNC machine.
Best wishes Tim

This is a very interesting topic and thanks to all those who have contributed. A few years ago I bought the parts for a stand alone CNC machine and made it. It took over three months to build and get right. For me this has been a game changer in that it can produce all the flat parts very accurately which can then be combined perfectly with 3D printed parts. This has required a slight shift in thinking in designing these combined parts but I have found it to be quite rewarding. Put simply the CNC has added yet another dimension to my modelling.

Hi Dave, welcome to the fourth category, hahahaha.
You're right.
"Centenial Tours" is also very fitting. Great job, Dave.

Hi Tim, I read your comments.
They're very insightful, and I agree with some of them, in fact, almost all of them.

I must say that Pat has started a very interesting topic.
Well done, Pat! Since you joined, you've greatly fueled the discussion and debate, greatly benefiting the forum.

Tim, just noticed your input. You are correct in many ways. I have been buying styrene sheet for those large flat areas. I usually get it large 4x8 feet pieces. I also use ABS in my filament printer. By using solvent cement I can "weld" the ABS pieces to the styrene sheet pieces.

I don't have a resin printer but a friend does. He made detail parts for me. The last pieces he made for me were 1/16 scale M1 Garand rifles for my figures in my halftrack. Even the trigger guards and triggers came out great!

However, materials are constantly changing, especially for resin printers. My friend even mixes different resins and has had some good results. The downside of filament printers was their speed. About a year ago, that changed significantly with breakthroughs in their technology. So users have to "keep up with the times".

Lew